>>24141
Of course many people want to read their weekly manga in the quickest and least expensive way possible.

What Viz is doing, is forcing their service onto to you whether you want them or not.

There's nothing wrong with the way the current system works. If Viz really wanted our money, then they should either just pay people like mangastream to keep doing what they are doing OR provide a better service that what we are currently receiving.

FUCK MY LIFE

Just answer me one thing . . Are we still gonna be able to find and read new chapters off other sites .. or is this going to be the beginning of something very serious and troubling?

>>24142
Yes. Yes it does. The only way the industry can get better is to support it when it makes the right decisions, and when people refuse to do that over petty bullshit like a two week delay, it ensures that any attempt to move toward a sensible business model is destined to fail. Which means we are going to be stuck with publishers who rely on lawsuits against fans and laws like SOPA until the publishing industry finishes its long-in-the-coming collapse.

>>24147
>petty bullshit like a two week delay
I wish I could wrap my hands around your throat right now.

>>24147
>The only way the industry can get better is to support it when it makes the right decisions
>support it when it makes the right decisions
>makes the right decisions

So you're saying the right decision is to shut down all competition, force people to pay and have a delay of two weeks.

>>24147

Haha, you actually believe the stupid bullshit you're saying, don't you?

Look at this:
http://www.onepieceofficial.com/videos.aspx

THIS is a step forward. THIS is a good business decision. No 2 week delay. Not even 1 day of delay. It effectively replaced fansubs, not by waving lawyer dick at them, but by providing a superior service where it mattered. For free.

Viz could do this too. The One Piece manga simultaneous online release is a feasible and wonderful idea. Until they do it I will punish them by not giving into their bullshit. I recommend everyone to do the same. If and when they DO start it, I recommend everyone reward them, even if it's a subscription service.

>>24150

Viz is already losing a ton of money. They're getting desperate.

They've already bent over backwards and released most OP volumes out there.

You're going to whine and not pay no matter what they do.

>>24151
>Viz is already losing a ton of money.

Well, they are doing something wrong. When they go bankrupt, something new and better will replace them.

>>24152

Or the manga industry in America will collapse and people will stop trying.

No matter what Viz or any company does, most people will just go online and read for free.

Viz is a business. It has employees and it costs money to pay them and to put books on the shelves.

It's not their fault when people are big whiny babies who use every excuse they can to get out of actually spending money.

>>24153
Or Viz and other american manga companies should start thinking about changing how their business works. The percent of americans who like anime and manga is very small and within that group are people who dont buy much anime/manga products.

If manga companies want to save money and deliver goods, they will have to start cutting costs that are not helping them at all.

You are really adamant about making people for products they wouldnt otherwise pay for. I guess according to your logic, all books should be sealed up and cannot be read until they are purchased, because alot of people are reading manga and other books for free in the bookstore.

>>24154

And I guess by your logic, Viz should just make its employees work for free, should go fully digital so they don't need to print and distribute books, and should put ads on its website so maybe they could make enough money to keep it running.

But even then, where would it get the money to license manga in the first place?

And no, I don't think bookstores shouldn't seal books. Most people that go there and read it will at least buy something once in awhile.

Heck, even if people only went to libraries, the libraries would have stil bought those books.

But when it comes to scanlations, you only need one person to buy that book/issue. After that, everyone can read it, and there's never any actual need to buy anything.

>>24154

I think there's pretty universal disdain for those sperglords who clutter up the manga aisles and get their cheetos dust all over the pages.

>>24156

*I don't think bookstores should seal books

>>24153

Except we know from Hulu/piracy statistics that the majority of people who pirate are impatient more than they are greedy. US used to be the leading culprit in pirating TV shows, because we wanted our shows at the tips of our fingers, and pirates provided that. Hulu offered the US a legitimate source to watch the shows you wanted at the time you wanted, just as the pirates had always done, and pirated TV show traffic in the US started dropping dramatically and is still sinking. People were perfectly willing to take the advertisements or buy the plus subscription, because it was not and was never about the money - it was about the convenience. If Viz wants to stop people from pirating manga, people will pay - provided they offer the same level of convenience.

As an anon above said, if they want people to stop pirating, they need to offer a superior product. Anything less is bad business practice.

>>24156
>And I guess by your logic, Viz should just make its employees work for free, should go fully digital so they don't need to print and distribute books, and should put ads on its website so maybe they could make enough money to keep it running.

No, you havent even read what I said.

I said that Viz should hire the people that are currently scanlating and delivering weekly manga.

If Viz's current paid scanlation team cannot do what people who are not paid and working in their free time can do, then Viz should fire their current scanlators and hire the people who translating and deliver OP on a weekly basis.

And its not a bad idea for Viz to go digital. They can print the popular series and shows, while charging people who want the less popular things online. Send that idea to Viz and they should consider it.

>>24156
>And I guess by your logic, Viz should just make its employees work for free, should go fully digital so they don't need to print and distribute books, and should put ads on its website so maybe they could make enough money to keep it running.
No, they think Viz should cut corners so they can release shitty versions of the manga quicker, the way the pirates do.

>>24162
But is Viz not translating these titles quickly because they can't or because they're contractually not allowed to? They've got a contract with terms and conditions and I wouldn't be surprised if somewhere on there was a clause that boiled down to them not being allowed to release the chapters until two weeks later.

It could be something entirely different all together, from bureaucratic bullshit to the fact that they simply can't put out a professionally done product at within that time frame. The only thing we know for sure is what they are doing, not why the aren't doing it any differently.

>>24150
>Until they do it I will punish them by not giving into their bullshit.
Keep in mind you're also punishing Oda for it. But I get the impression a lot of you really don't care about that.

>>24164

Yeah, this exactly. There is exactly zero doubt in my mind that the two-week delay is a result of their contract with Shueisha, not technical demands. Like you said, it only takes a few days to translate and typeset a chapter, and Shueisha could easily provide them with the original text in advance of the street date. And let's assume for the time being that Viz isn't completely retarded. The appeal, both on the consumer side and the business side, of simultaneous release is beyond obvious. There's absolutely no reason why Viz wouldn't want to have as close to simultaneous release as they could. All the delay does is cost them business to scanlators. There's no logistical reason for a delay of that length, so it's almost certainly a contractual one; Shueisha doesn't want them releasing it any sooner than that.

If the delay is the only thing holding you back from supporting Shonen Jump Alpha, you should probably consider supporting it anyway, because the only way you're going to get simultaneous release is if it's successful. If Shonen Jump Alpha makes a lot of money, that'll give Viz leverage in future contract negotiations with Shueisha to carve out more generous release periods and drive the release delay closer to what you're looking for.

>>24156

I know you'll just ignore this post, like you have ignored all my other posts, and also all the posts by other people that argue against you, but think about this.

The One Piece simulcast exists. It is doing well.
This means that it is making more money, directly or indirectly, than it costs.
It takes more time and effort to sub anime than scanlate manga. This means that it would cost more money to sub than to scanlate.
More people read the manga than watch the anime. This means that they have a larger potential customer base.

So you have a proven system. You can make an identical system, targeting the same general demographic, for less money, and with more expected returns. In exchange, you will need to change nothing of what you are doing, except start 2 weeks earlier.

Now I am going to blow your mind, so pay attention.

You don't need to make money on it. You don't really even need to break even. This is because weekly chapters are just an advertisement. An advertisement for the full volume, for the databooks, for the merch. Shueisha does not make much money off of Weekly Shonen Jump. Online distribution would just be another form of advertisement. A cheaper one. Publishing costs much more money than having a website.

Now, you're thinking of the anime when you consider licensing costs. This is not a problem for the manga, because Viz is owned by Shueisha. Really. There goes that problem. Poof.

Are you concerned about employee salary? Why? Probably because you have the idea that companies employ dozens, or hundreds of people in every division, right? Shueisha employs around 800 people. Total. If there were more than 10 people directly involved with this Shonen Jump Alpha thing my head would explode in disbelief. Now, I'm not sure if this is the same in the manga business as it is in mine, so take this ONE thing I'm saying with a grain of salt: paying salaries should never be more than 20% of your operating cost. If it is more you have failed and should consider contributing to unemployment statistics by firing yourself for being so shitty. Replacing your entire workforce with self repairing perpetual motion robots would not increase your profit as much as you think. You know what will?

Becoming the "good guy." How do you become the good guy? By giving people what they want. This is tricky sometimes, because often people don't even really know what they want. Not in this case. You have a fun and funny creator making a quality product. Just looking at a picture of Oda makes you think "yup, this guy deserves my money." And so people buy manga volumes to support this Oda guy that makes the comic they love so much (personally, I don't even read my volumes). Funi became the good buy purely by not being 4kids. Suddenly, unedited DVDs with no earmurder. Then they gave people MORE than what they wanted in fast and quality subs, same day as the japanese broadcast.

How could Viz become the good guy? Hire a good translator? Check. Have a high quality product? Check. Go fast? Doable. The pirates are the good guys right now. Knocking them down makes them the bad guy. Beating them would make them the good guy, and make the pirates irrelevant. You can't defeat piracy. You will never defeat piracy. And it doesn't matter, because pirates are not your target audience. Someone that is motivated solely by the drive to not pay money will never buy your product. Never. Even if you send providers to jail, or send some cease and desists to some sites, or even shut down the internet somehow. They will find a way. But not all pirates do it to not pay money. You don't seem to understand this, but it is true. Some just want a quality product. Quality in this case means speed. You go fast, you win. Viz could go fast. They could go so fast that it would be literally impossible for anybody to even get close to them.

Why do they waste money and time on legal threats instead?
Because they're idiots. They control the company. They can change procedure. They don't do it because they're scared. It's fine to be scared, but it's going to keep hurting them. Funi does it fine, and they have the harder job. Could it fail? Of course. But I don't think so.

>>24165

Another meaningless passive-aggressive quip. Why am I not surprised?

>>24162

>I said that Viz should hire the people that are currently scanlating and delivering weekly manga.

No you didn't.

And you're giving Mangastream too much credit. Their scans were shit.

>And its not a bad idea for Viz to go digital. They can print the popular series and shows, while charging people who want the less popular things online. Send that idea to Viz and they should consider it.

Shows how much you've actually gone on their site. They already do that.

>>24169

>And you're giving Mangastream too much credit. Their scans were shit.

IT. DOESN'T. MATTER.
The choice between fast scans and slow scans is the choice between a car with pretty high mileage and a car with NO MOTOR.

>>24170
Only really it's more like the decision between a car with pretty high mileage right now and a brand new car with all the features two weeks later.

>>24172

NO
Nothing matters besides speed. Nothing matters besides speed.
Nothing matters besides speed. Nothing matters besides speed.
Nothing matters besides speed. Nothing matters besides speed.
Nothing matters besides speed. Nothing matters besides speed.

Do you understand? Ok how about this one:
Fast scans are like delicious drinkable water.
Slow scans are like more delicious drinkable water that you can't enjoy because you're fucking dead from dehydration. Understand?

Fast scans are like scanlations that come out right away with varying fair quality; slow scans are like Viz quality scans and translations that come out two weeks after they are released in Japan.

OK, I just got the news. I used to go to Mangastream, but now that they're pretty much dead to me, where should I go to get the quickest/highest quality scanlations now?

I think we should stop arguing with this guy. Logic and reason just kind of slide right off of his self-righteousness.

>>24173
>Nothing matters besides speed.

Are you really really sure about that?

>>24169
>And you're giving Mangastream too much credit. Their scans were shit.

What do you expect from an amature group that doesnt get paid to scan and translate manga. If a company were to hire groups like mangastream, then customers will still get their weekly series and the company gets their business.

>>24180
Oh lordy lordy loo. You just reminded me of those early FMA translations. Thing came out once a month, too.. so kinda inexcusable.

>>24153
So fucking what if the manga industry in the US fails? It's not entitled to be profitable. If their business model doesn't work, and a different one isn't profitable then what reason does it have to still be in business?

Well looks like mangarule will be releasing the new One Piece chapter this week, and from now on.

What a waste of time and effort.

>>24183
It makes it much more expensive for those of us who actually like to help support the manga-ka who entertain us to do so, because shipping prices from Japan will easily double the price of the manga itself. And that means the number of manga we can buy is cut in half.

>>24185
It might suck for fans, but that's not the point. If the fans aren't enough to keep a business afloat then their business model needs to change.
If Viz dies, then Viz, Shusei or both fucked up. That's the end of the line.

I personally ain't gonna subscribe to this WSJ alpha thing, because as a customer I'm bloody well within my rights to not pay for something I don't think is worth my money.

>>24186
But you're not a customer. And you don't get to "make a statement" by refusing to buy something but still reading it anyway.

You can still do it, but you're not within your rights to do it. Do not delude yourself into thinking you are crusading for consumer's rights here: you are simply taking whatever you want and rationalizing why it's okay for you to do so.

>>24180

Please. Blurry cellphone pictures of chapter 598 took down like 4 sites due to overwhelming traffic. Errors like that don't actually matter when it comes to a group's popularity if they go faster than everyone else. If they did, why do almost all of our chapter generals start with a mangastream link?

>>24187

Are you an idiot? Why do you keep talking about money like it matters in this argument. Because it doesn't. Can't blame you, though; I understand you gotta copy-paste your answers fast.

>>24187
I'm not within my rights to read scans online which breach copyright, you're correct about that. But that's not what I was saying.

If Viz want my money, they have to offer a service that is worth it. I'm not going to give them money for a subpar service, because that doesn't incentivize them to improve it (because as far as they're concerned, they've made their money)

>reading One Piece and not pirating like the heroes you read about

Yarrgh, you lot of salty barnacles are doing it wrong. Don't listen to these soggy-britched sea cucumbers -- FUCK Viz!

>>24188

Whoa you mean images of the new designs after a month-long wait and a two-year timeskip got people excited knock me over with a feather!

In exceptional cases like that you might get a surge of interest but you aren't going to make yourself popular with blurry cell phone pics or the baby being broned. Not so long as there's any other scan provider out there. Mangastream's success can be attributed that it managed to be passable in all fields...except translation, which were consistently awful, but awful in a way that was invisible to the casual reader.

>>24191

>you aren't going to make yourself popular with blurry cell phone pics

Jokes on you, I still miss himajin. We all miss himajin. Ohana and T ain't shit. Not a wednesday goes by that I don't think back to the Good Days, back when resisting spoilers actually meant something. Unless the chapter was really good, in which case I only think of the chapter. I'm sure himajin would forgive me, though. I'm sure himajin would understand.

we all miss himajin

but for my two cents here: this'd totally be worth buying if we only had a one week wait. i could go without the brand flipping newest chapter if we still got it at a reasonable speed. two weeks makes it remarkably difficult to avoid spoilers which is sort of the opposite of what i want.

So where do we go to get scans now?

Moment of truth tomorrow.

>>24173

Not sure if troll or just retarded.

>Where will I be able to access Weekly SHONEN JUMP Alpha?
>Currently, you can only access Weekly SHONEN JUMP Alpha from the U.S. and Canada.
>be european

That's nice

>>24216

Well get your European buddies together and mail them en mass.

One letter will make no difference, but I bet a hundred would.

>>24217
Why bother?
I'd rather just let Viz crash and burn through bad business practice.

>>24217
Wouldn't do any good. I guarantee you that the only reason they're not allowing access from Europe is because they are not legally allowed to because they don't hold the license there. Same thing with Hulu and Netflix--they definitely want your money even if you're in Europe, but they aren't allowed to take it because of licensing issues.